We could do with some guidelines on how to give C&C

Hey Guys,

I think it would be a good idea to help newbies know how and when to give C&C. We could create a thread and either sticky it or put it in our tips section.

I think we need to word it so it's not merely a tips thread, but that it lists some do's and dont's too - we can then mention it in our Posting Guidelines as well.

Some things I think we need to cover:

• When should you consider giving C&C
• How should you go about it
• Some things you should not do when giving C&C
• What is C&C?

Whaddya think? Let us know your tips, do's n dont's etc, and then we'll look at creating the thread

Yep, some bullet points may be useful although I'm not sure if you are raising this because some people are a little harsh or simply because there is a way C&C should be presented. It should also cover editing of pictures as I know some people don't take kindly to editing of their pictures if they don't have the edit flag set. (BTW, I am not necessarily referring to me in this instance!). I am aware some people pictures have been reposted with things cloned out or altered in some way.

I don't like it when people edit my pics! Though I have said it before, and I have removed the edit flag.

I don't mind what people say as long as they are polite, and not just critical. I want honesty,but in a polite way!

...and, once again I say this, it would be so useful if people actually put some information with their photographs.

Many magazines do this with readers pictures, publishing the exposure info. and a little bit of the circumstances...'I had been watching the landscape for a few days and where the sun came up so decided to visit at 7 in the morning', 'I converted the picture into black and white by... in Photoshop using this layer because... so that....'. 'I used f2.8 to throw the background out of focus...' 'I switched my camera to 'vivid' and compensated with +.3 ev Feedback should be essentially positive and encouraging even if it is to go and do it again...and hopefully for the photographer a process of self realisation about what could be better (if anything), opinions will all differ in relation to what the art, what appeals or not but we should all recognise blurred images, exposure issues etc. Feedback tends to be positive, with the negative or issues sandwiched in (should there be any), end on positive... that's how I feedback to my learners anyway...but who am I to say? (Well I am a trainer, but not a photographic trainer you will be pleased to know... )

...and then I was reading teachers in schools are discouraged from using red pen, it's demotivating and discouraging... Actually despite thinking the UK is a bit too pink and fluffy, I can understand that and have seen the effect... aren't art people meant to be sensitive souls too? Ah...

I would always like some constructive C&C how are us beginners going to improve in any way if no-one is allowed to advise us on points?

Ok here's a few thoughts, not final, just thoughts at the moment...

Giving

• First things first, be polite - there's absolutely no excuse for rudeness. If you think someone is taking the mick, use the report post icon to let a mod know instead.
• If the topic is 'not your bag' then steer clear, unless you can offer a helpful and fair critique.
• (If you're a newbie, then) Don't offer a critique unless you know what you're talking about (at least master the basics first) - however, feel free to leave a comment if you like the photo.
• Remember when offering a critique you should be trying to help that person take 'better' pics, so bear that in mind when you post (and remember, that people are more attuned to what you say if you put your point across in an amicable manner, so try not to make them feel stupid or small, not asking you to pat their egos, just be pleasant that's all).
• Don't leave a comment or critique if you have fallen out, or don't get on with the person who's photo you're viewing - this can result in a ban so take heed.
• If you're not sure whether you should be offering a critique or not, ask yourself, could you have taken the photo in that same situation, better? If not then it may be an idea to pass... but feel free to leave a comment if you like the photo.
• Don't edit and repost someone's picture unless they have the 'edit ok' icon showing in their post. If you do your post will be deleted without notice (so please don't!). If you really want to, make a posting asking permission first, if the photographer who took the photo agrees, then go for it.

Receiving

• Don't get offended! People are only trying to help. If you feel that someone posted something that wasn't helpful, then use the report post icon to let a moderator know - they'll review the post and take action if they see fit. To help us, please let us know why you think the post should be looked at.
• Learn to take criticism. You know what - it's tough hearing people point out the negatives! But if you want to truly improve your skills then you need to get over that - just remember that people are offering you their opinion in the hope you might take it on board and take better pictures. If you feel they should not be offering a critique on your photo (because they're a newbie or don't know the basics themselves perhaps) - then use the report post icon to let a mod know, who'll take action if they deem any necessary.
• Don't think that critiques you receive automatically mean you took a crap photo - the photo may already be great, but people may be posting to help make it even better!
• If someone has edited your photo and reposted it despite you not having the 'edit ok' icon, then report the post and a mod will delete it.

Some exceptions

The only exception I can think of that would be ok, is if an inexperienced C&C'er wanted to give C&C, either to 'practise' or because they felt they had something valuable to offer - then to simply begin their post with something like:

I hope you don't mind me offering a C&C as I'm not really experienced, but I just wanted to say....

This just lets the OP know that the person offering a C&C is not really experienced, and that they're doing so more for themselves than anything else... but at the same time they could raise a valid point.

So anyway, that's just a few thoughts, mostly common sense stuff really... whaddya think?

Fine by me, as long as people are polite and not rude, I don't mind what anybody says xx

Whatever we do its got to be supportive and honest, I mean my idea of a good shot might be totally different to yours and if you,ve spent a bit of time on something the last thing you need is someone knocking your efforts and your confidence.

Don't know about others but it feels as if you are doing nothing but taking if you are continually looking at others work and offering your own for comment/critique but never giving a comment/critique on the work of others. There are forums where you are not allowed to ask for comment/critique unless you in turn have offered your thoughts on someone else's work.

You may not know an image is underexposed but you can still comment on the effect the underexposure has made on you. I know I keep banging on but if a critique is to be purely on the technical merit are we not ignoring the main reason for taking a photo that of communication.